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Post by SalfordSlim on Dec 12, 2018 17:05:44 GMT
Ok so I've managed to miss pretty much all the votes for the Willows Wall Legends which have been taking place on the club website. However, I've just had a nosey on the website and stumbled across the vote for Hooker.
Now I've "only" been supporting the club since '89 and in that time you can count on one hand the number of top quality hookers we've had. Hands down (until a couple of years ago) Malcolm Alker would have my vote. Great player and massively underrated by opposition fans but his admissions of PED taking and recent "misdemeanour" which has led to jail time has massively clouded my opinion of him (in much the same way as most of my childhood heroes have been tarnished by the child abuse scandals).
So what does everyone else think?
A) Should the club even have him on the list due to reasons stated above?
B) Would you/have you voted for him in the poll?
Btw, I went for Peter Edwards, one of my fave players from the early days.
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Post by bonitared on Dec 12, 2018 17:30:20 GMT
Rugby players reflect society. Some law abiding,some not.
Whether playing for us now,or being voted upon,I find it difficult to moralise.
Not seeking to defend past or present players,just saying let’s focus on their playing ability.
For the record,I thought he was probably overrated. Fantastic club man and tough tough bloke and great tackler but limited and he’d struggle in today’s game.
I’ve gone for Mark Lee but I had to think about this one because the others were mainly shoe ins
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Post by redunderthebed on Dec 12, 2018 19:34:29 GMT
I went through a similar thought process SalfordSlim. Alker’s autobiography really put me off him. It wasn’t the drug taking. that made me feel sorry for him as much as anything - the addiction to painkillers, the desperation; putting himself through all that pain physically and mentally I can absolutely get why drugs seem like the best option and why he has struggled so much since he retired. I don’t teally but into the whole role models must be perfect thing. I don’t believe that spirts stars should be above the law or morality but they should be allowed flaws like everyone else. I want my kids and others to see that you don’t have to be perfect to be successful cos no-one is perfect and some idealised versions of perfection being held up can be unhealthy. I liked his honesty and his candour in admitting what so many pros hide
I didn’t like his attitude to other players and his team mates and I didn’t like his big fish, small pond approach to life. What can be seen as loyalty to Salford came across a little as fear of not being the no 1 man if he went somewhere else so staying where he felt secure
That said. His contribution on the pitch for those 15 years was immense. He had his limitations for sure but he put his body on the line for us week in week out, he led the team on the pitch, he played the best he could in every match, he had a few seasons where he was top quality in attack and defence and his entire career his defence and work rate was exceptional. So in the end I voted for him
Mark Lee was a fantastic player but had his best years at scrum half for us I think. Mark Moran was a favourite of mine when I started watching so it took me a while to warm to Lee when he took Moran’s the place and it was only when he moved to SH that he really started bidding the team. I didn’t appreciate Lee enough at the time and would be happy if he won it. But I felt my vote couldn’t go to him for best hooker for the reasons I said
Peter Edwards was one of my favourite players. He was hard, classy. quick, good hands and I loved to watch him play. But he didn’t quite have that X factor that gives him a place on the wall. He didn’t leave an indelible mark on the club as an individual. He wasn’t with us long enough and didn’t achieve anything significant enough. (Although He was in the team that beat Wigan in the cup and that team should get a wall all of their own 😊) but compared to Alkers contribution to the club I couldn’t justify choosing Edwards.
I only saw Groves play for Salford once or twice but I suspect he was better than any of the ones after him. But I didn’t feel I could vote for him as he wasn’t Watkins, Risman, Hesketh etc that I felt could vote for despite never having seen them
So Alker for me in the end
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Post by redunderthebed on Dec 12, 2018 19:34:57 GMT
I might be overthinking my voting decisions 😊
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Post by bonitared on Dec 12, 2018 20:20:40 GMT
I might be overthinking my voting decisions 😊 Ever so slightly 😂😂😂 |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 12, 2018 20:23:05 GMT
I might be overthinking my voting decisions 😊 I bet you do the same for Britain's got no talent too. |
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Post by JJR on Dec 12, 2018 23:45:37 GMT
Salfords best hooker was undoubtedly Frank Boardman. He could do nothing else but he could always win the ball.
He did however score a try at Warrington. A goal kick was taken, he was ambling around, probably waiting for his half time fag, and the ball fell in his hands, whence he was double tackled which pushed him over the try line.
But a great hooker in the pure sense of the word.
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Post by SalfordSlim on Dec 13, 2018 0:06:26 GMT
I went through a similar thought process SalfordSlim. Alker’s autobiography really put me off him. It wasn’t the drug taking. that made me feel sorry for him as much as anything - the addiction to painkillers, the desperation; putting himself through all that pain physically and mentally I can absolutely get why drugs seem like the best option and why he has struggled so much since he retired. I don’t teally but into the whole role models must be perfect thing. I don’t believe that spirts stars should be above the law or morality but they should be allowed flaws like everyone else. I want my kids and others to see that you don’t have to be perfect to be successful cos no-one is perfect and some idealised versions of perfection being held up can be unhealthy. I liked his honesty and his candour in admitting what so many pros hide I didn’t like his attitude to other players and his team mates and I didn’t like his big fish, small pond approach to life. What can be seen as loyalty to Salford came across a little as fear of not being the no 1 man if he went somewhere else so staying where he felt secure That said. His contribution on the pitch for those 15 years was immense. He had his limitations for sure but he put his body on the line for us week in week out, he led the team on the pitch, he played the best he could in every match, he had a few seasons where he was top quality in attack and defence and his entire career his defence and work rate was exceptional. So in the end I voted for him Mark Lee was a fantastic player but had his best years at scrum half for us I think. Mark Moran was a favourite of mine when I started watching so it took me a while to warm to Lee when he took Moran’s the place and it was only when he moved to SH that he really started bidding the team. I didn’t appreciate Lee enough at the time and would be happy if he won it. But I felt my vote couldn’t go to him for best hooker for the reasons I said Peter Edwards was one of my favourite players. He was hard, classy. quick, good hands and I loved to watch him play. But he didn’t quite have that X factor that gives him a place on the wall. He didn’t leave an indelible mark on the club as an individual. He wasn’t with us long enough and didn’t achieve anything significant enough. (Although He was in the team that beat Wigan in the cup and that team should get a wall all of their own 😊) but compared to Alkers contribution to the club I couldn’t justify choosing Edwards. I only saw Groves play for Salford once or twice but I suspect he was better than any of the ones after him. But I didn’t feel I could vote for him as he wasn’t Watkins, Risman, Hesketh etc that I felt could vote for despite never having seen them So Alker for me in the end Cheers RUTB... that synopsis has just kept me going the whole "last train home" from Halifax to Victoria.😉 Even in my pi$$ed up state I reckon I can see exactly where you're coming from on the Alker thing. Given all merits/flaws on the field I would vote for him every time. F*ck me he's no James Roby (but then who is?) but as a player I can't remember anyone who bled more for the club. As for Peter Edwards... I was 11/12 at the time and my memory is shite! Hence I am embarrassed to say I couldn't even guess how long he played for us! |
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Post by kreuzbergred on Dec 13, 2018 0:31:46 GMT
Salfords best hooker was undoubtedly Frank Boardman. He could do nothing else but he could always win the ball. He did however score a try at Warrington. A goal kick was taken, he was ambling around, probably waiting for his half time fag, and the ball fell in his hands, whence he was double tackled which pushed him over the try line. But a great hooker in the pure sense of the word. What Decade did he play in ? This is the first time I've heard of him I'm sure he was a Great player but there's been a lot of Players mentioned in the vote that are new to me and lots of other supporters I do think a lot these players Were playing before tv coverage started with the Floodlit trophy I believe , Also I'm guessing Lot of people who were watching in the late 50s and 60s maybe 50+ years later slightly over exaggerate how good these players were due to people's memories differing from what actually happened. week week in Week out. |
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Post by red54 on Dec 13, 2018 5:38:44 GMT
For all his faults and misdemeanours I would still vote for Malc Alker. Anybody that would play a week after having their appendix removed must love the Club and the Sport and I don’t think in my opinion enough has been done for him.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2018 5:53:33 GMT
I voted for Alker as quite frankly he was a class above a great many he played with and could have jumped ship and gone to a better UK based team or the NRL.
But he is proof you can't cure stupid.
How he's ended up is sad, when he is released the RL community should help him and use him to help try and educate today's players about what a fickle world professional sport is and the need to plan accordingly.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2018 6:56:48 GMT
And therein lies the whole validity of this type of election. How can we know the greatest players over 100+ years... most of us weren’t around to see all the players. Currently the elected team doesn’t include arguably Salford’s 2 most famous men James Lomas and Gus Risman. I saw the great team of the 70s but not the 30s team. Obviously I choose Watkins et al. Younger fans can only choose their greatest Steve Blakely etc. The whole exercise is fun but pointless.
Ask Saints fans how they arrived at a Cunningham statue and not one of Karalius or Van Vollenhoven or Murphy.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2018 7:20:21 GMT
And therein lies the whole validity of this type of election. How can we know the greatest players over 100+ years... most of us weren’t around to see all the players. Currently the elected team doesn’t include arguably Salford’s 2 most famous men James Lomas and Gus Risman. I saw the great team of the 70s but not the 30s team. Obviously I choose Watkins et al. Younger fans can only choose their greatest Steve Blakely etc. The whole exercise is fun but pointless. Ask Saints fans how they arrived at a Cunningham statue and not one of Karalius or Van Vollenhoven or Murphy. Exactly. But as an exercise to increase interest this is good. Next season it should be best pint, hot dog and subsequent diarrhea. |
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Post by osrd on Dec 13, 2018 8:32:29 GMT
Salfords best hooker was undoubtedly Frank Boardman. He could do nothing else but he could always win the ball. He did however score a try at Warrington. A goal kick was taken, he was ambling around, probably waiting for his half time fag, and the ball fell in his hands, whence he was double tackled which pushed him over the try line. But a great hooker in the pure sense of the word. What Decade did he play in ? This is the first time I've heard of him I'm sure he was a Great player but there's been a lot of Players mentioned in the vote that are new to me and lots of other supporters I do think a lot these players Were playing before tv coverage started with the Floodlit trophy I believe , Also I'm guessing Lot of people who were watching in the late 50s and 60s maybe 50+ years later slightly over exaggerate how good these players were due to people's memories differing from what actually happened. week week in Week out. Frank Boardman was my super hero at the time,1951 onwards,and as JJR has said all he did was hook the ball out,sometimes illegally for which he used to get fined 10 shillings (50p)by the disciplinary. As well has having a cigarette at half time he could well have had a beer as it was said that on a match day,always Saturday,he would work Saturday morning,get the bus to the Langworthy Hotel,have a couple of pints and then play. Having said all that I voted for Malcolm Alker for his all round game and 100% effort over many years. |
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Post by SixOrSeven on Dec 13, 2018 9:25:58 GMT
Malc Alker for me, although its sad to see the way he declined off the field, on the field he gave everything he had. Proper player and should be rightly recognised for being so.
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