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Post by redunderthebed on Aug 3, 2020 8:09:33 GMT
I don't get this. 'Taking the knee' is disrespectful? So when Liz is about to knight me, my kneeling is disrespecting her? I don't think so. Of course it isn't it's a mark of solidarity against something that's been wrong and rotten for a long time.
Martin Offiah is a bit too careful but balanced the thing a little.
the BLM and NHS banners were a very good move and Sky are trying very hard to be on the right side of all this.
He was right we should be celebrating RL's efforts on this front and those comments in the crowd don't help.
The wife tells anyone she hears being racist to go to football where they'll feel much more at home.
I agree with all that you said Russ apart from the last bit. I go to a lot more RL than football but I go to football a fair bit. I’ve heard more racist comments at rugby than football sadly. Kick racism out has been much higher profile than any RL attempts to address racism. Racism has no part in any sport. I think it was more overt in football but that’s partly because it gets more attention and the links to hooliganism. Having said that I did decide attending England football games wasn’t for me after feeling like I was attending a BNP rally the few times I went. Don’t have to worry about that in RL! |
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Post by bonitared on Aug 3, 2020 8:16:09 GMT
Back to yesterday’s Sky coverage,I’ve always liked Stuart Pyke but he was whistling through what sounded like new teeth,unless it was my telly.
Apologies from me if he has an illness I’m not aware of.
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Post by bigkeev on Aug 3, 2020 9:30:05 GMT
I noticed Israel Folau was the Only Player not to Take the Knee No doubt there's Some Religious reason why he didnt do it . I'm so Greatful that My Parents never Forced Religion on me or my Siblings . It seems unnecessarily antagonistic to imply that he or indeed anyone was else has religion "Forced" on him mate. I can speak from experience that Spiritual epiphany is a thing, and he seems to be pretty genuine in his beliefs. I assume its something to do with the fact that some denomination's of Christianity treat kneeling as an act of worship, so choose to kneel before no one other than god. Personally as someone who does have faith I dont really have an issue with Kneeling per se, although when younger and a bigger pain in the arse, I almost lost a job because I refused to bow to the Queen at the Lowry Centre. 20 years on I would much rather take a knee as an act of solidarity over something I believed in, than bowing my head to someone considered my social superior due to nothing other than accident of birth. I dont care how nice an old lady she is. |
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Post by redunderthebed on Aug 3, 2020 11:25:13 GMT
Back to yesterday’s Sky coverage,I’ve always liked Stuart Pyke but he was whistling through what sounded like new teeth,unless it was my telly. Apologies from me if he has an illness I’m not aware of. Agreed. Is there a phrase for having a voice for radio? As well as the whistle, he’s quite new to TV commentating and I suspect it’s a fairly different art that takes some getting used to. |
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Post by Old Dave on Aug 3, 2020 13:05:25 GMT
I also thought Pykes voice sounded different to normal and hope he is ok.
I go to Salford city and despite there being a number of people near us who I would class as undesirable have not heard any racist comments in the two years I have been watching them.
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Post by russ on Aug 3, 2020 14:02:16 GMT
To be honest I think racism is far more acceptable at football and RU and cricket. The example of the missus was from more than one occasion by visiting fans at the Willows but not always. Football is far too nationalistic to avoid and that is a growing trend in England generally.
They are far too sporadic (good word that!) but what they express without being challenged is that it's alright to be that way, carry on it's okay and it doesn't matter if it carries on elswhere in any form.
I do hope this means Martin will becime a more regular pundit on Sky though.
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Post by Carnster on Aug 3, 2020 14:38:53 GMT
I noticed Israel Folau was the Only Player not to Take the Knee No doubt there's Some Religious reason why he didnt do it . I'm so Greatful that My Parents never Forced Religion on me or my Siblings . It seems unnecessarily antagonistic to imply that he or indeed anyone was else has religion "Forced" on him mate. I can speak from experience that Spiritual epiphany is a thing, and he seems to be pretty genuine in his beliefs. I assume its something to do with the fact that some denomination's of Christianity treat kneeling as an act of worship, so choose to kneel before no one other than god. Personally as someone who does have faith I dont really have an issue with Kneeling per se, although when younger and a bigger pain in the arse, I almost lost a job because I refused to bow to the Queen at the Lowry Centre. 20 years on I would much rather take a knee as an act of solidarity over something I believed in, than bowing my head to someone considered my social superior due to nothing other than accident of birth. I dont care how nice an old lady she is. Devil's advocate here, no pun intended... I think what he was referring to when he said 'forced' is that kids don't often get the choice when it comes to religion. If their family or parents are religious then it is in effect 'forced' as they grow-up in the religion of their family. I'm sure a lot of religious people don't see it this way, and that's fine. It's also something that former religious people attest to being a negative in their lives. As for taking a knee, well it's just a symbol. Symbol's can be powerful and in this case a positive social force, unless for some reason a symbolic act gets your goat for some reason. My thoughts on Falau not taking a knee is one of indifference. It's his choice. Worth noting, both Offiah and Leon Pryce said that Falau not kneeling was fine as it's a personal choice. |
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Post by Carnster on Aug 3, 2020 14:42:15 GMT
To be honest I think racism is far more acceptable at football and RU and cricket. The example of the missus was from more than one occasion by visiting fans at the Willows but not always. Football is far too nationalistic to avoid and that is a growing trend in England generally. They are far too sporadic (good word that!) but what they express without being challenged is that it's alright to be that way, carry on it's okay and it doesn't matter if it carries on elswhere in any form. I do hope this means Martin will becime a more regular pundit on Sky though. Offiah would be a great pundit. He's knowledgeable, eloquent, and always comes across as unbiased. Certainly the kind of personality that bridges the social gap that certainly exists in the RL media. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2020 16:45:09 GMT
Read earlier somewhere Falau and 'others' didn't take the knee any idea who else didn't?
Are we 100% he did this on religious grounds?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2020 16:56:56 GMT
I saw Sam Moa mentioned but not sure who else. It’s their right not to get involved. If they forced everyone to do it, it makes it a meaningless gesture. The media fixation on Folau also undermines the gesture the vast majority of players made and leaves a bit of a bad taste for me. I’d rather ignore the idiot.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2020 17:02:51 GMT
I saw Sam Moa mentioned but not sure who else. It’s their right not to get involved. If they forced everyone to do it, it makes it a meaningless gesture. The media fixation on Folau also undermines the gesture the vast majority of players made and leaves a bit of a bad taste for me. I’d rather ignore the idiot. My views on him are well known but it's his right, unlike his Tweets that got him sacked by Rugby Australia this is his choice. |
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Post by bonitared on Aug 3, 2020 17:16:02 GMT
I saw Sam Moa mentioned but not sure who else. It’s their right not to get involved. If they forced everyone to do it, it makes it a meaningless gesture. I fully support the BLM movement but this is totally correct. |
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Post by redunderthebed on Aug 3, 2020 20:40:16 GMT
From what I’ve seen it was all of the players except Falou. As others have said it should be a personal choice as to whether you do it or not And it’s peoples choice as to whether they criticise people for doing it or not doing it.
I haven’t seen much active criticism of Falou for not doing it just people commenting on the fact he didn’t. I’ve seen lots and lots of nonsense criticising the others for doing it. Peoples right to comment either way but many of the comments do not show the fabled RL family in the best of lights
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Post by bigkeev on Aug 4, 2020 8:17:39 GMT
It seems unnecessarily antagonistic to imply that he or indeed anyone was else has religion "Forced" on him mate. I can speak from experience that Spiritual epiphany is a thing, and he seems to be pretty genuine in his beliefs. I assume its something to do with the fact that some denomination's of Christianity treat kneeling as an act of worship, so choose to kneel before no one other than god. Personally as someone who does have faith I dont really have an issue with Kneeling per se, although when younger and a bigger pain in the arse, I almost lost a job because I refused to bow to the Queen at the Lowry Centre. 20 years on I would much rather take a knee as an act of solidarity over something I believed in, than bowing my head to someone considered my social superior due to nothing other than accident of birth. I dont care how nice an old lady she is. Devil's advocate here, no pun intended... I think what he was referring to when he said 'forced' is that kids don't often get the choice when it comes to religion. If their family or parents are religious then it is in effect 'forced' as they grow-up in the religion of their family. I'm sure a lot of religious people don't see it this way, and that's fine. It's also something that former religious people attest to being a negative in their lives. As for taking a knee, well it's just a symbol. Symbol's can be powerful and in this case a positive social force, unless for some reason a symbolic act gets your goat for some reason. My thoughts on Falau not taking a knee is one of indifference. It's his choice. Worth noting, both Offiah and Leon Pryce said that Falau not kneeling was fine as it's a personal choice. Never Apologize for a pun mate. I suppose its subjective, one persons "Forced" is another's "Encouraged". Growing up my mam was religious and my dad wasnt at all. I sort of came to it on my own as an Adult. I just sometimes think people treat faith as some kind of mental illness, and is fair game for sly jokes and remarks. Not suggesting that's what this lad was doing, I am admittedly a bit sensitive about these things. As a big ex-doorman type with a bald head people make certain assumptions about you, and more than once people have gone off in front of me about "bible bashers" and "imaginary friends in the sky" and stuff far more offensive, assuming that I would simply agree or find it acceptable. Most of the time I manage to resist the urge to get involved or wipe my feet with there face. Each to there own though I suppose. What I feel/ believe is difficult to quantify or qualify and trying to explain it to someone who doesnt, is pretty difficult so I dont preach. Feel free to believe I'm delusional, all I would ask is people who think so have enough respect to not assume people like myself are ok with being told we are. Anyway, moan over, for what its worth I agree about Offiah. He comes across well on the TV and would be a good pundit/advocate of our sport, and for people over a certain age he is still almost a household name. It would be win win as far as I'm concerned, especially if he quit being a n agenct and advising our players to look for beter deals elsewhere. |
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Post by Carnster on Aug 4, 2020 9:50:15 GMT
I have no problem with what anyone else chooses to believe as long as it doesn't impact negatively on others, or influence government policy. What you are saying boils down to human decency more than anything. Something that seems to be lacking in a lot of people.
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